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Friday, October 15, 2010

I went to Church..

Disclaimer: This post is not the view of every member of this blog but solely reflects me and my views. It will definitely be offensive and I know this will not stop you from reading but I just want to point that out. I urge you to read objectively and rationally and I welcome all comments negative or not. This is a long post so grab a cookie



I went to church and as you well know this cannot end well.  I tried to pay attention and give the bible a chance and now that I am sane(r), I can now rationally say "The bible sucks". I understand this is a book that means a lot to be billions of people but to me it means nothing. And as thus I am going to give it the same respect as I would to a John Grisham novel.

While the bible does offer a lot of upliftment and encouragement, I can get the same thing from an inspirational novel or one of those self help books. To me, the bible is a sexist pig. Well maybe not the whole bible but the writers of certain parts of the bible to be politically correct. So if I am trying to be correct I should say "Some of the bible sucks". Is that better?

Call me a self righteous feminist but I believe men and women can and should be treated equally. I have uni-sexualised my words and thoughts and behaviors. So when the bible starts with its belief of submission on the part of just women I am immediately defensive. So today the pastor happened to be talking about woman's role in life and as soon as he started reading from that chapter I should have walked out and would have saved myself this whole post but I didn't because well they were serving food after the service (Judge away). So being the open minded individual that I am, I walk up to the pastor later respectfully and ask him if he doesn't think the bible is sexist. He starts off by saying since I am not christian, I cannot understand the bible and all it's complexities, basically he finds ways to bullshit around the whole issue and gives me one or two verses where the bible praises womanhood. I walked away because I could not be bothered to argue when there was good food being served and honestly I was about to start cursing and that would be disrespectful.

I get so tired of this, “You’re not a Christian, so obviously you don’t know anything about the Bible.” I grew up with the Bible. I probably know a lot more about the bible than some of you. I went to Sunday school. I went to church. I went to Wednesday services. I sang in the church choir. I’ve read the Bible.

While, yes, there are some parts of the Bible that do move away, slightly, from the view that women are inferior, there aren’t nearly enough of those passages to overcome the overall view that women are second class citizens in the Christian religion and that the preferred woman is one who is silent, chaste, and submissive.

A big part of the reason why, despite spending 15 years where Christianity was all that I knew, I never could commit to the faith was because of the degrading way the Bible treats women. Over and over and over and over.

Yes, I understand that the Bible is reflective of the culture that produced it, which was misogynistic and believed/treated women as inferior and as property. The issue I have with the excuse that the Bible simply reflects the culture during which it was written is that makes the Bible something that can be dated and more importantly outdated. If they allow for that then how can it really be the true Word? In my mind as soon as someone allows for a less than perfect rating on the Bible - the entirety of it is questionable and their entire religious stance is flawed.

Either own the whole Bible or none of it I say.
(I choose the latter)

However, that only reinforces my belief that the Bible is far more a product of humans than it is of anything divine. And any divinity that honestly advocated for the sort of ideas about women that are so frequently espoused in the Bible is one that doesn’t deserve my worship, praise, and certainly not my obedience.Which is why I cannot bring myself to believe in the same biblical God that Christians do.

I get it. Christians pick and choose what parts of the Bible are important and unimportant. While it’s admirable that you choose to ignore the more sexist and dehumanizing passages of the Bible in favor of the more progressive passages of the Bible, because you believe it’s more in keeping with the spirit of Christ, it doesn’t really change the content of the Bible, which says a lot of things that I find deeply offensive and insulting and damaging.

It doesn’t really change the fact that those who hold anti-women views can find more than enough backup to reinforce their views in the Bible…which is far less a matter of what is or isn’t.

So, yeah. I’m not a Christian. But it doesn’t mean that I can’t read the multiple passages that say, “Women, you are to be submissive to your husbands,” and not be able to figure out that what the Bible is saying is, “Women, you are to submit to your husbands.” It’s nice that you read that and go, “Well, it could mean something else,” or “Well, there’s this other part that is nicer to the ladies.” But to argue that these words somehow confused me because I am not christian or that I shouldn't question God is just unacceptable. 

Seriously?

The Bible begins, in Genesis, with putting all the blame for the pain and suffering of humanity on a woman’s shoulders. And then women are punished for all eternity because one lady got down with a serpent.
“Of the woman came the beginning of sin, and through her we all die.”
Women are viewed as subjects of their husbands.
“Wives, submit yourselves unto your own husbands, as unto the Lord. For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the savior of the body. Therefore as the church is subject unto Christ, so let the wives be to their own husbands in every thing.”
Women’s value is seen almost exclusively in their ability to keep their mouths and their legs shut.
“A silent and loving woman is a gift of the Lord: and there is nothing so much worth as a mind well instructed. A shamefaced and faithful woman is a double grace, and her continent mind cannot be valued.” 
“Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience as also saith the law. And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church.”
“Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection. But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.”
“That they may teach the young women to be sober, to love their husbands, to love their children, To be discreet, chaste, keepers at home, good, obedient to their own husbands, that the word of God be not blasphemed.”
“Every man praying or prophesying, having his head covered, dishonoureth his head. But every woman that prayeth or prophesieth with her head uncovered dishonoureth her head: for that is even all one as if she were shaven. For if the woman be not covered, let her also be shorn: but if it be a shame for a woman to be shorn or shaven, let her be covered. For a man indeed ought not to cover his head, forasmuch as he is the image and glory of God: but the woman is the glory of the man. For the man is not of the woman: but the woman of the man. Neither was the man created for the woman; but the woman for the man.”
 So does that mean Female pastors are going to hell? Is Benson Idahosa's wife going to hell for not always covering her head or does her weave count as a hair covering? And then there are verses that prevent women from teaching in church. (I Corinthians 14:33-35, 1 Timothy 2:11-12).” Actually, it’s “Thou shalt not SPEAK in church.” At all. Ever. And this time it's from the new testament too. I mean if Mrs Idahosa wasn't going to hell before, she is now and so are your female pastors and deaconesses. I mean really and then you sit there and tell me how I should respect the bible and believe in it?
Take that shit home, bitch (in the words of co-blogger and future mating partner, Realist) and eat multiple dicks.




21 comments:

El-Divine said...

Vanity! yesu...church will fall down for u one day. idk y u keep going sef...lol, but dnt stop.
neways, lemme from the start tell u that personally, as a practising xtian, i have come across, and VEHEMENTLY disagreed with paul's words in corinthians. and while i understand that u kno the Bible as much as i do, i just want to give a lil perspective.
the Bible is not like d quaran. d quaran says everything written came str8 from Gods mouth. Christians v never claimed dt. they claim divine inspiration for the works of men, and few parts that are wholly attributed to God or Jesus. That is what makes some parts of the bible canonical, and some, not.
"As soon as someone allows for a less than perfect rating on d Bible-the entirety of it is questionable and their entire religious stance is flawed."
That's placing d Bible on a pedestal it cannot survive on. so inevitably xtianity will b flawed to u. in actuality, the bible is not the cornerstone of the xtian faith, even tho half of xtians assume it to be. the cornerstone of the xtian faith is the PERSON of christ. who Jesus was, what he did, and what that means for us. Muslims believe Quaran is the literal Word of God. Xtians bliv JESUS is the literal Word of God made flesh. John 1.And when Jesus left, he dint say "Read the Bible so u can know what is right to do" he said "I will send u d Holy Spirit to continue to guide u in my absence." The Bible is valued bcos it is a good introductory manual, and reference point to what Jesus did. But christianity is more than d 66 books of its Holy Book. Far more. Eventually, ur gonna v to leave the word written about him, and encounter Jesus/Holy Spirit for urself, like Paul did. Till then, ur not yet a christian "in truth, n spirit".
so what am i driving at...Yes, Paul's words are sexist, in view of today's society. that shows his limited vision. Look beyond him to the one who understands our core essence, and knew that women are as much worthy of respect as any man.Jesus never uttered a sexist word in his life. and he is the AUTHOR and FINISHER of our faith. so christianity is not sexist.
and yea, Mrs. Idahosa, if she does go to hell, it wont b bcos of her hair covering, or the absence of it.
I hope i helped, and dint just reinforce stereotypes, but if I did, rest assure i spoke d whole truth as i have learned it. Thanks for this post

El-Divine said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Myne Whitman said...

Hmm...no comment.



ok one, I think you're pushing beyond controversial and topical, to offensive.

Azazel said...

Lol..
El Divine Paul was in the spirit of christ when he said what he said concerning women in the Book of Timothy..
Sooo??

Vanity said...

@El-Divine I keep going because everyone is convinced that this one time will make a difference "Go this one time, my pastor is a correct man of God, all the other ones that couldn't reach you were fake."

Yea they may not have claimed that it came from God's mouth but they say it was inspired by God or God told them in some kind of vision or whatnot and clearly Jesus speaks in the bible.

I know that Christ is the corner stone of CHRISTianity and all his amazing sacrifices. And you know Jesus said this "I will send u d Holy Spirit to continue to guide u in my absence." because it is written in the bible, no?

Not once in my whole spiel did I mention anything about Christianity, I focused largely on the book

And even Jesus was sexist "Simon Peter said to them, 'Let Mary leave us, because women are not worthy of life.'
Jesus said, 'Behold, I shall guide her so as to make her male, that she too may become a living spirit like you men. For every woman who makes herself male will enter the kingdom of heaven.'" Unless of course he has an amazing sense of humor and was being sarcastic.

Thank you for your reply mr

Vanity said...

@Myne what exactly offends you?

Realist said...

LOL...haha yea i go to a Church of Christ Church. They believe in doing it exactly as it says in the bible. So there are no instruments and women do not come close to the altar. I always looked at the women and wonder how they felt that they were basically the backbones of the church, but they were not allowed at the altar. I just know if i was a woman, it will not sit well with me.

As for the bible itself... i am coming to terms with it. I dont think it is the perfect word of God, i feel it has been corrupted.

Realist said...

btw. nice post, Vanity. and love the eat multiple dicks reference.

Nutty J. said...

This is my own opinion of this.

The bible also goes further to say

"Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church''...

do you know how much Christ loved the church?

Jesus was a romantic...if it was this day and time he would have said John 14:1-2 like this:

“My love, do not worry, Trust in God; trust also in me. My dad is very very rich..in his house are many rooms; if it were not so, I wouldnt say so. I am going there to prepare a place for you. And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come back and take you to be with me that you also may be where I am. All I ask is that you wait for me...I'll be back soon”

HE died for the church...that was how much he loved the church. so the same 'sexiest' bible tells men to love their wife to the extent that they be willing to die for her...do you know what that means?

All the woman has got to do is submit to her husband as unto the Lord....now who do you think the bible favoured in its dictates? The man...or the woman?

Vanity said...

@Nutty OMG! Jesus didn't die for just his church.. he died for everyone. Also picking one single passage cannot dispel the other parts that for the majority refer to women as inferior. Denying us the freedom to speak or have an opinion? The bible still favors the man babe

The Messiah said...

hahaha @ the "self righteous feminist." I don't think you have any idea what modern day feminism is like. They're mostly like "power to the pussy and fuck all niggas with that power (not literally either)," you seem to be too sane to be a feminist. Anyways, thats a different discussion. More in tuned with the topic at hand, there are 2 reasons God is referred to as "He": 1) because he has a dick 2) because he is one. That explains why the book he supposedly wrote has a lot of fucked up content in it. Nice pic btw

... a teen. said...

Hmm.
Come to think about it. The Bible was written in those days where there was nothing like education and stuff.

Soo, nowadays, women are more educated and there have been changes in women's position and stuff so the Bible has nothing to do with it.
Yes, some parts of the world might still go with the Bible but I'm guessing that's a minority.

Society isn't like that anymore.

dangel said...

awww :( i consider this a very sad post.. are you a christian or a muslim? but even if, i am a christian and i respect all other religions and their beliefs..you coming out to say these words against a Holy book is just sad but then again its your opinion.
you must remember that books in the Bible were written at different times and by different people directed by the HolySpirit. It teaches me and what I do is take the lessons from it and applyto me at this TIME. Imagine if another book were to be added, you might not find all the strict rules that you listed against women in the new book because we are in a different age.
what you have done is look at the Bible in your own way and with your own level of understanding.
and if ur a muslim try and be respectful.. if i went to a mosque and did not agree with the words in their Quaran, i wont still disrespect the religion/their book...
God bless.

Vanity said...

@TheMessiah Modern day feminism? My definition of feminism is equality to all, even men but I guess that would make me more of a humanitarian, no?

and you know God has a dick how? Because he fucked you in the ass or because he's referred to as he in a book that is probably fictitious? Anyway my argument wasn't if God was a he or she

also what do you mean by too sane to be a feminist? Is there some kind of insanity level?

Vanity said...

@ a teen your belief that only some parts of the world goes along with the bible's definitions of the bible makes me want to smack you upside the head. I live in the U.S and I've seen the kind of stupidity that goes on here using the bible's ideals.

and read the section in the post that talks about the bible maybe being outdated

Vanity said...

"Yes, I understand that the Bible is reflective of the culture that produced it, which was misogynistic and believed/treated women as inferior and as property. The issue I have with the excuse that the Bible simply reflects the culture during which it was written is that makes the Bible something that can be dated and more importantly outdated. If they allow for that then how can it really be the true Word? In my mind as soon as someone allows for a less than perfect rating on the Bible - the entirety of it is questionable and their entire religious stance is flawed.

Either own the whole Bible or none of it I say."

I think many of you failed to read that part

Vanity said...

@Dangel I dont see how it matters what my spirituality is and once again you've brought about how my understanding affects my reasoning of the bible.

I can't even argue with you, I am not in anyway of form going to respect a book that expects me to shut up and reminds me that I do not exist outside of my husband. Look you're going to argue for your book and religion whether it makes sense or not so go right ahead and please come back when you have a logical arguement.

xx

The Messiah said...

@Vanity "Modern day feminism? My definition of feminism is equality to all, even men but I guess that would make me more of a humanitarian, no?" <-----Actually, yes. That would make you a humanitarian. Feminists, NAACP, or any other interest group you can think of aren't about equality, but more about their interests mainly because they're out to empower a CERTAIN group rather than try to make ALL groups equal.

"and you know God has a dick how? Because he fucked you in the ass or because he's referred to as he in a book that is probably fictitious? Anyway my argument wasn't if God was a he or she" <------I know He has one not because He fucked me in the ass silly, but because that's what He used to get Mary pregnant. And even tho it isn't ur arg, the fact that in biblical times there was a norm of huge inequality between men and women (and women got the short end), would explain why God (being an owner of a dick aka male) didn't seem to have a problem with that (keeping in mind this was the norm).

"also what do you mean by too sane to be a feminist? Is there some kind of insanity level?" <-----Well, the first paragraph explains all, but I'll go further. You're for equality, they're for power. I think that should explain all.

Tarzye said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Tarzye said...

Unfortunately incase you don't know those verses that you quoted are used in a specific context. it would be stupid to state that just because PAUL said it means that you should follow it. Is Paul Jesus??? and if you're going to go on and on about the Bible being sexist you might as well condemn every single religion that there is, because in every religion, the woman should submit to the man. Even people that do not believe in the bible believe that. and @Vanity that said we shouldn't use some parts of the bible to say that the bible is sexist.. we shouldn't use some parts of the bible to say that the bible is sexist. I mean COME ON!! don't antagonise yourself. In very few places is the bible is sexist towards females and don't be daft, before nko who should be the head of the family?? the woman shey???? please now... the Bible just uses common sense.. and did the bible say women should be idiots and follow their husbands blindely???? dang! Paul didn't know EVERYTHING! and even though he was learned and educated.. that was the limit of his education.. The Bible includes instances were the apostles are wrong and when other people corrected them. Peter for example corrected a disciple when they said it would be impossible to help the gentiles recieve the Holy Spirit.. I like your blog.. But get ALL the facts wont you???

ShadeNonconformist said...

Hmmn.

I'm not going to lie this post resonated with me because I've been struggling with this issue since i was a teen. It's like how come certain parts of the bible make me (women) appear to be of a "lesser" value? But honestly, what has been helpful for me is that i focus on the fact that the bible was written by men who were divinely inspired by God. They obviously had their own flaws. But the divinely inspired being is amazing, is not sexist and loves me for who i am. The same bible tells me so. And I'm also learning to understand that there are certain things that i can never comprehend. If i did comprehend everything, i would not give God the honor he deserves. So it is what it is. I'm still a working progress. I still argue with people about it. But God is definitely working and refining me and I'm thankful for that. But it's not easy. I take solace in the fact that God's word never fails, in-spite of the issue(s) i have with certain chapters in the bible.

I get where you are coming from and I do take issue with people who rather than having a logical discussion with others who take issue with the bible, bring up all sorts of irrelevant BS. Focus on the issue at hand. It's just very annoying. I really wish the pastor had been more open and honest about the questions you had. Al the beating round the bush is just bleh. Some people forget that a brief "encounter" or discussion can save someone's life/soul or bring them to Christ. Whatever the case might be, I will keep you in my thoughts & prayers. Just saying:)

PS: Granted i know i have a potty mouth, but I think the disrespectful part that Myne alluded to might be the last paragraph:(